UPDATE: RANGE RESULTS - Need a starting point for 6.5 x 55 Swede.

Discussion in 'Reloading Forum (All Calibers)' started by logandiana, Jan 19, 2020.

  1. logandiana

    logandiana Gold $$ Contributor

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    I just bought CG-63 on a whim yesterday at the gun show. I’ve never had anything in any 6.5 caliber before and I am unsure what bullet weight would be best for 6.5x55 Swede.
    The barrel is 29 inches, and the twist is 1:230mm (1:9in)
    I was hoping to try the 150 SMK but they say it needs at least a 1:7 twist. So what are my other best options for 140ish grain bullets. Hornady? Berger? A lighter SMK? Not sure what weight was shot with these originally.
    Thanks
     
  2. SSL

    SSL Gold $$ Contributor

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    Best I can tell, the older Swedes had a 1 - 8 1/2" twist in most cases to fire 156-grain round nose bullets (changed to 140 in 1941). Of course bullet length is the key here rather than just weight. Little surprised that yours would be that slow. Remeasure to be sure and under no circumstances try to form brass from 30-06 brass. 30-06 cases are .008 to .010" smaller in diameter and will bulge at best or destruct at worst.
    Good luck.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2020
  3. piie

    piie

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    I've had good results (for hunting purposes) with Nosler 140gr Ballistic Tips, Nosler 142gr Accubond LR as well as the Norma Oryx 156gr. Even though I have a "modern" Steyr - it seems most (all?) European manufacturers tend to chamber them long to cater for surplus military rounds, so that sort of makes your seating choices easy - don't even try to get a 140 to touch the lands - ain't gonna happen.

    H4350 also works very well as a powder (have used IMR4350 as well).
     
  4. Exercion

    Exercion

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    Original M96 barrels were slightly faster than 1 in 8. If that CG barrel us over 8 inch twist, I am guessing it was to optimize for the 139gr class bullets. My military Swedes have all loved Lapua Scenars, Hornady Amax, and Sierra 142 Matchkings. They love slow powders, my go to one's being 4831SC and RL 22, though RL 19 works too. Use Lapua brass, nothing else is even close plus it is the correct dimension.
     
  5. Freiburger

    Freiburger

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    I can confirm with my M96/38, it loves the 140 grain S&B 2905 bullets. But also as above mentioned Lapua and Hornady 139 grain bullets.
    As powder I use VV N150 which is recommended for the old swedes over N140. However, I am still figuring out a good load. Friends of mine use 37.5 grain N150, but in my M96 this is not enough, the catridges have still smoke residues all over. That is why I will try some loads between 38 and 40 grain the next weekend.
     
  6. FryeGuy

    FryeGuy

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    I had a CG that had a replacement stock. I took it as a payment for some work i did back in the day. the bore was rough as it could possibly be. I never fired it. I sold it to a guy I worked with at the time for $200. I helped him scope it, and took him to the range and taught him how to shoot with it. The ammo we used was some reloads I had from when I owned a remington classic in 6.5x55. They were sierra 100 grain HP varminter bullets. Rough bore or not that gun shot under an inch with that load consistently. He learned to shoot very quickly with that old rifle and it taught me to shoot a gun no matter what before selling it. even cheapo factory ammo shot well in it. we had a blast shooting it. so don't be afraid to try lighter bullets and loads in it.
     
  7. daleboy

    daleboy Silver $$ Contributor

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    I have a couple,one likes the 144 Berger,the other likes the 140 Hybrid better . Both shoot very well so I think they are worth a try for you . My barrels are about 1/7.75" or there abouts .
     
  8. hunter67

    hunter67

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    I think they came with 1x7.7 or 7.5 older ones anyway. Mine has shot 155 Mega and 140 AB and 142 LRAB to 1/2min with 100v and H4350
     
  9. Busterman

    Busterman

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    I have owned a CG63 for awhile and have shot it out to 600 yards using mostly RL22 and 139gr. Lapua Scenars and Nosler 140's. Anything larger especially 155gr. SMK's would not stabilize. 40 to 44 grs. of RL22 will work well. My rifle has a GF rear sight and a 16mm front soldered on. Make sure your rear sight is tight (mine was not). CG63's are well made and can be very accurate at any distance. Lapua brass is the best I have used.
    Don
     
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  10. wbm

    wbm

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    _.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  11. Zero333

    Zero333 Silver $$ Contributor

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    CG-63 most likely have barrel twist of 1 turn in 220 mm which = 1 in 8.7"

    Stick with 120 / 123 gr. bullets. You will not regret it.

    H-4831sc would be my first choice for powder.

    With 120/123 gr bullets, MAX would be around 49 gr H-4831. So start at 45 /46 gr.

    H-4831sc = Accurate with out exceptions.
     
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  12. tomswede

    tomswede

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    Still have my CG63 that I got as a junior back in the early 70’s. They all performed very well with Norma’s 139gr loads.
    140 class bullets do well, if the Sierra 140 MK does not shoot there is something wrong with the rifle. R19 has worked well for me. With so many other rifles mine has gathered dust for years but did shoot it at 600 yards last year, not used to the ergonomics anymore
     
  13. 2506

    2506

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    Unless you rifle has a special barrel it is between 7 1/2 and 8" twist. It is a metric measurement. I have a number of the Swede military rifles and one 96 that has been sported. I have shot from 100 to 160 gr bullets in them and all a very accurate with the right powder and charge. Like has been said if it will not shoot the Sierra 140 match king something is wrong. Take into account that these rifles are rated for 46000 CUP MAX pressure so don't try to hot rod it.
    This load comes out of the older Sierra manual as the accuracy load and it is mild but VERY ACCURATE in all my numerous Swedes.
    Unless your barrel is wore out you will be astonished at how accurate it will be.

    37.8 grs. IMR 4895, Remington or Lapua case, CCI-BR2 primer, 140 Sierra Match King, COAL 3.050

    For hunting loads with 120 and 140 gr bullets I really like Accurate 4350. I have found that the max loads listed in the Accurate manual with these weights bullets are very accurate and in the 29" barrels really get high velocity even through these are under 65000 CUP loads.
     
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  14. STOMP442

    STOMP442 Gold $$ Contributor

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    Sierra 142s and IMR4064. She will run like Forest Gump in a football game.
     
  15. logandiana

    logandiana Gold $$ Contributor

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    I have remeasured several times and it looks like I was off slightly on my first time. It turns out the twist is only slightly faster at 1 in 8.66 ( 1 in 220mm).
    According to the berger twist rate calculator, it looks like am going to have a tough time shooting the longer 140+ grain bullets as they won't be stable.
    Looks like I am going to have to stick to the 120-125 range.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2020
  16. jonbearman

    jonbearman I live in new york state,how unfortunate ! Gold $$ Contributor

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    I run 120 matchkings and nothing heavier than 140 grains with a flat base as weight goes up from 123 grains. The rifle you bought should be a decent shooter. Keep us up to date on how she shoots.
     
  17. Herzo

    Herzo

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    I've been shooting my model 96 Swede (built in 1899) in CMP sniper matches for the last 6 years. Limited to a 4X Weaver (K4) at 300 & 600 yards. I have never had a reason to change from 37.0 grains of IMR 4064 behind a 140 grain Sierra.
     
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  18. 2506

    2506

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    No you will not. Your rifle will shoot 140s just fine. Also be advised that the Berger twist calculation is what is optimum for that bullet. You will never know until you give them a try. The 156 gr RN military bullet is a long sucker with a lot of bearing surface. I would say that your chamber is cut just like the military rifles and they have long throats for that long 156 gr bullet so don't think that with shorter lighter bullets that you can load to get close to the lands. With a round loaded with the 140 Sierra Match King at COAL 3.050 which will just fit in the magazine and work fine but is still a looooog ways from the lands still will shoot as good as you can hold with the load I mentioned earlier.

    I once went to the range and there was this guy there that I knew was very anal about everything and always put a bunch of money into every rifle he had but he really was not a very good shot.
    He had a 8 inch steel swinger set up at 500 yards and was shooting off the bench in a full bench rest type press bag set up. He was shooting a rifle he described as a "blue printed" Rem 700 with a heavy Heart match barrel in 308 Win. with 168 Match Kings. He could pop the steel most of the time. I ask if I could take a shot at it with my rifle and he said sure. I go get my rifle out of the truck which was a full military dress 96 Mauser Swede. The only thing I had done was change the front sight blade to one that was higher so I could bring the POI down to match the back sight settings. This was my vintage military match rifle that a group of guys had started up way before it got popular with the NRA. This fellow did not know that I had this rifles sights dialed in so I could set for 500 yards. He ask if I wanted to use his rest and I said no. I sat down on the ground and got into the sling and fired and DING. Fellow said "you got lucky". I said "probably did, what to bet $10 I can do it again". I knew he was the type of person that would take the bate. He said "I will take that bet." I got into my tight donut hold and fired and DING. Sure did thank that fellow for the gas money to the range and back that day. LOL
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
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  19. Mike7.62

    Mike7.62

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    I have only used the Swede for hunting, and that only for whitetail deer and feral hogs. The two bullets with which I have had great success are the Hornady 129 Interlock, and the 120 gr Nosler Ballistic Tip. I also use the latter in my .260's for the same purpose. The 129 is effective, but the 120 BT is like lightning, as in Dead Right There type results. Probably due to the thinner jacket, but I have always had bullet exit from all game shot, and an excellent blood trail.

    The only downside to using the lighter bullets is the distance from the lands when using them. The standard chamber in the 6.5 Swede is exceptionally long because the military load for it utilized a 160 gr FMJ. My first commercially made rifle in the 6.5 Swede was a Winchester M70. It drove me crazy with 6" groups at 100 yards until I measured the distance from the lands and found that it was darn near a tenth of an inch jump from the ogive to the lands in both factory and handloads. I began to load the bullets further out in the case to place the ogive within a few thousandths of the lands but still have decent bullet tension/seating depth, and fit/feed from the magazine correctly. This shrunk the groups to 1.5" average, which is plenty good enough for the purposes for which it is used. My Ruger #1 in this cartridge has similar chambering.

    For target use I would recommend the Hornady 140 gr ELD Match and the 143 gr ELD X. The latter is touted as a hunting bullet, but is still a very slippery bullet (BC .625 G1/.315 G7) for longer ranges. Alternatively, you could just shoot Hornady 157 gr Match HP's or Sierra 150 MK's if target shooting is your goal, and probably not worry about ogive to land distance.

    Have fun, and welcome to the world of 6.5. As a solid .30 caliber guy for most of my life, I have been sold on the 6.5 because of great performance on game and targets with much less recoil than alot of .30 caliber cartridges of the same capacity. Don't misunderstand, I still shoot and hunt with the .30's, but I seem to be reaching for the 6.5's more often than not.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  20. Kurz

    Kurz

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    The CG-63 rifles were re-barreled for heavy target barrels using the 1:8.66" twist rate (220mm). The ammunition was most often M41 surplus. Privi Partizan makes brass and loaded ammunition for these rifles.

    One thing to check for sure are the dimensions of the bore and groove. Using a lead slug, upset the slug so it fits the bore/groove snugly. Tap it out and measure it. There is a possibility that the groove diameter might as large as 0.265" rather than the now standardized 0.264".
     
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