running a 1:9 twist for .223

Discussion in 'Small Stuff--22s, 20s, and 17s' started by loud_noise, Sep 1, 2017.

  1. chromatica

    chromatica

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    I am also considering .223 for F Class. I ran some numbers to see how twist affects stability. I used Sierra Matchking as the benchmark. Here's what I came up with:

    69gr needs 9 twist
    80gr needs 8 twist
    90gr needs 7 twist
     
  2. Baddog0302

    Baddog0302 Gold $$ Contributor

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    Don't know about the other two rifles you mentioned or your preference on trigger breaking weight on your other competition rifles, but my suggestion would be a Savage. Long story short, my swap bbl. Savage long action has a Savage SS fluted 223 Bbl. and shoots MOA with both H 75 bthp and both 77 SMK and NCC at 300 yds. { limit of my range}. The Rifle Basix 2 trigger breaks at 8 oz. I don't like a big change in trigger pull's when switching from the Savage to the 2.25 # AR triggers
    Just my $0.02
     
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  3. cocopuff

    cocopuff

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    my question is what do you mean by saying the bullets shot ok...Is this at 100 yards or beyond.? I know if some people can hit a paper plate at 100 yards that is ok..to me if they wouldn't do at least 1 1/2 inch at 300 it aint good enough..Last new barrel I got with a 7 twist was piss poor at 300..So i'm going to put my 9 twist back on..That barrel is going back tomorrow...
     
  4. JBT

    JBT Gold $$ Contributor

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    What kind of barrel was your 1-7"?
     
  5. cocopuff

    cocopuff

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    mcgowin
     
  6. Clucknmoan

    Clucknmoan Silver $$ Contributor

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    Sent back 2 McGowen 6.5 barrels last year. No more for me.
     
  7. JBT

    JBT Gold $$ Contributor

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    I've known a couple of guys with McGowan barrels that shot pretty good. But, I hear more negative than positive on these barrels.
     
  8. Clucknmoan

    Clucknmoan Silver $$ Contributor

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    It's too bad. The first bad one was no biggie, it happens. Then it took 13 weeks to get a replacement and it was bad too. I was less than impressed with 13 weeks to warranty a barrel.

    It's the wasted time more than any cost involved.
     
  9. Clucknmoan

    Clucknmoan Silver $$ Contributor

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    I should contribute instead of hijacking the thread. My 9 twist .223 shoots 69 SMK's well. Haven't tried heavier.
     
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  10. JBT

    JBT Gold $$ Contributor

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    I even had good luck with 77 SMK's in one of my 9 twist barrels. Not so good in another 9 twist. YMMV
     
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  11. Clucknmoan

    Clucknmoan Silver $$ Contributor

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    After reading this thread a couple weeks ago it motivated me to look for an alternative to these 69 SMK'S. BC isn't great and the ES was fair at best.

    Tried to get some 75's VLD's to shoot and they were fair, but pressure showed early and I was also afraid with winter coming my 9 twist wouldn't shoot it well in the real cold. Plus my throats pretty short so there's way more bullet in the case than I'd like to see.

    Decided to also try some 70 VLD's and I'm really impressed. Haven't tried to tune seating much, but they are shooting pretty dang well for a factory rifle. Im really impressed with these Savages. They seem to shoot.

    Of course I pulled one, dang fingers were cold.
     

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  12. stacy

    stacy 2 TIMOTHY 2 VERUS 15 Silver $$ Contributor

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    I HAVE A SAVAGE TACTICAL 1998 MODEL 223 1/9 LONG ACTION 24'' AND THAT THING SHOOT AMAZING WELL WITH 68 GR BTHP MATCH AND 75GR BTHP MATCH HORNADY'S WITH VARGET AND 450 PRIMERS SO I THINK THE SAVAGE WOULD FEEL YOUR NEEDS OR THE HOWA THEY SHOOT VERY WELL ALSO HAVE A FEW OF THOSE ALSO GOOD LUCK
     
  13. 284winner

    284winner Silver $$ Contributor

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    Thank you !!! I have a 9 twist that WILL NOT shoot the 75 amax to save my _ _ _ ! Tried everything from velocity, powder, primers, neck tension, seat depth to even brass variations. Nothing. Nice to know someone else has one that won't shoot them. Seems most guys replying here have good success in the 9 twist with the Amax bullets. Figured it was just me. Guess I'll stick with my 69 SMKs. They do shoot.
     
  14. Texas10

    Texas10 Silver $$ Contributor

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    If you like the 69SMK, don't be afraid to try the 69 TMK's. They shoot a bit flatter and gave me better groups at 300 yds.

    Another good one to try with that twist is the 53 gr. V-Max. It'll surprise you with how far it'll shoot. Good BC.

    My son shoots tiny groups with the 53 VM and 3031 and absolutely killed the 4 inch targets at 500 yds with it in a good 'ol Savage 12FV.
     
  15. AckleymanII

    AckleymanII Gold $$ Contributor

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    +1 on the 9T, mine 28" Shilen 75g A max would not stabilize in the 223 AI
     
  16. Topstrap

    Topstrap

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    Had a 9 twist Savage that shot 75 amaxs with 8208 really well. Shot it one year at Rayners 1000 yard matches and did very well even on the 1000 yard targets. Pretty much one hole at 100. Changed to 7 twist for heavier bullets but didn't outshoot the old 9 twist till I got past 700 yards.

    Topstrap
     
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  17. 284winner

    284winner Silver $$ Contributor

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    There on my grocery list
     
  18. loud_noise

    loud_noise

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    G'day eveyone

    Thanks very much of the responses and advice.

    My reading on the advice generously provided above is that 1:9 in quality custom Barrel will yield results with most projectiles up to 60-69gn. Off the shelf rifles and barrels will be a bit more finicky but still perform perfectly for hunting applications and short range target work 100-250m odd.

    I was able to play with a Tikka T3 Varmint in 1:8 twist in 22" in Barrel on the weekend. I was shooting out to 400m and the wind was challenging 10km-20km gusts with left to right shifts. Holly heck those things can shoot.

    It kept well within the 6 ring at 400m on a ICFRA target which is the same size as 300m.
    I'm pretty much sold on the Tikka Varmint and might just save my dollars go with the Tikka off the shelf as I don't want to fuss about with new barrels immediately.
     
  19. Mozella

    Mozella

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    Not "all day long", but the SMK 69's with IMR 8208 XBR shot very well from my factory Howa 1500 with a 1:9 twist. Here's a screen shot of an Excel worksheet of the best 30 groups, nearly all 5-shot groups at 100 yards. I wish all my guns and all my various calibers did as well as this combination, that's for sure.

    upload_2017-9-25_20-59-40.png
     
  20. Knotwild

    Knotwild Silver $$ Contributor

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    You won't go wrong with the Tikka. One is in the classifieds right now. Another benefit is that you can swap out a spring in the trigger and have a very nice trigger pull for around 10 bucks. The only negative about the Tikka is that I personally don't like the plastic stock, but it doesn't affect accuracy.

    There also seems to be growing interest in pre fit barrels for Tikka's. Criterion is one company making prefits.
     
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