ppc advice - my first

Discussion in '6PPC, 6-6.5x47, 6XC, 6 Rem, 243' started by Schandler, Jan 20, 2019.

  1. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    Finally i have a sako vixen coming my way but it's doesn't have sako barrel. Barrel replaced with they believe hart 14 twist ntn. I'm getting dies and a few pieces of brass with it and purchased from member here. I'm all tore up about it and can't wait until it arrives. I would like to ask for suggestions on load info. Bullet powder primer and even brass and scope choice. I have weaver 36 and Nf br 42 to put on it. I do not compete but would like to see a ragged one hole target if possible. I know it's not a custom action but have read this single shot sako shoots really well. I hope the hart barrel is improvement. The dies are Forster and neck bushing is 266 and gives good neck tension and rifle will shoot tight now with previous load and he is using a cheap v max 58 gr. Just looking for suggestions to help improve and any other suggestions you would like to pass on to a new ppc owner. All suggestions appreciated
     
  2. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    Forgot to ask also looks like it has two standard bases for rings of choice to use. Does Sako have built in base like a ruger ? And I should find Sako bases or if not what would be good solid choice for rings mount for this rifle and I’m interested in buying here if anyone has what is suggested
     
  3. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    If i wanted 100 new brass would Lapua be th choice and will it need any type of fire forming or is it ready to load and would it be wise to clean up necks inside outside ? Where is the go to place for ppc supplies ?
     
  4. R.Morehouse

    R.Morehouse Gold $$ Contributor

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    Right here in the Classifieds with the WANTED prefix would be a good way to go for your 6ppc needs. Best of luck........:cool:.........Happy Shooting.

    Regards
    Rick
     
  5. JEFFPPC

    JEFFPPC

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    Way back in the day I had 2 of the Sako A1 single shots. One was a 2 digit serial the other was a very low 3 digit. First one was as accurate as some built guns I have been around. Never bedded it, just shot it. Second was just another factory varmint rifle even after bedding. Hope yours with the addition of an aftermarket barrel is as good as my first one. Yes, brass will need fire formed. I think you can find some folks on this forum that will do that for you with new Lapua 220 Russian brass. Try to find someone in your area with a PPC and they can mentor you and make the learning curve easier. Remember the loads you see on this forum are in custom actions and will be hotter than what you will want to use in the Sako. Have fun.
     
  6. P1ZombieKiller

    P1ZombieKiller Gold $$ Contributor

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    you say it is a No turn neck.... do you know for sure? IMHO if you are looking for greatest accuray even in no turn neck chambers, you should turn the necks to clean them up. You can turn them down to .0138 or so with a skim, but .0132 is a good place with the newest lot to be 100% cleaned. If you were given a 266 bushing, and the necks were not turned, you would be running more than normal neck tension. However.... if the previous owner has supplied this info, and it works in your gun... I would most certainly test/try/start there.

    Generally speaking... you have a few choices for brass. Norma makes "6 ppc" brass... this should take little fire forming, and be the easiest. Most folks I know use Lapua. You have to work with it a bit, but a rue of thumb, it should last longer. I have never shot Norma, but have heard if running stout loads, the primer pockets don't hold up as well.

    also... I ALWAYS suggest a Harrells FL sizing die. Them are a semi custom die, and are an excellent value for the money.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2019
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  7. djporter

    djporter Silver $$ Contributor

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    PM sent
     
  8. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    P1 thanks for thanks for the info. I am not sure on the no turn just going by previous owner. I am getting 40 pcs brass set of Forster dies and a few loaded rounds with rifle. The bushing was ordered for the dies and gives correct neck tension is what was told. I need to buy Lapua brass and thought about buying box of new. Anything wrong with buying used from here as long as i size ? Also neck turning - i have the setup from rcbs that trims outside and inside at same time and i just use it to clean up necks for 6br. I haven’t read about too many people cleaning inside up too but any thoughts on using it for ppc as well ? Or should i just turn outside ? As far as full length sizing i assume that’s what will come with rifle but will have to wait until i get all the stuff. Will post more after i get it. Thanks fellas
     
  9. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    Also wanted to ask if i lean toward lighter load how often do you have to trim brass ? And the Harrell’s die - is that the one where you send them a fired case and they make the dies using it ?
     
  10. P1ZombieKiller

    P1ZombieKiller Gold $$ Contributor

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    I personally never go with used brass, but That's assuming I have a brand new barrel.
    You trim the brass when ever you need to, it all depends on your chamber specs.
    Yes... Harrell's is the place you send 3 fired cases. FYI..... Unless you use the same reamer each new barrel..... you may need a new die each time.
     
  11. dgeesaman

    dgeesaman Gold $$ Contributor

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    So here are my thoughts and questions. I have two A1s with factory chambers, they’re generous, but I can’t run Lapua in them without neck turning.

    Anyway, we don’t know what kind of chamber is cut into yours. So first priority is to figure out what chambering you’re working with. I can tell you the Sako action is a nice shooter but it can’t hold up to the heavy loads the custom action shooters use.

    To get warmed up just skip the Lapua for now and try some Norma. The necks are bit thinner and they can hold up to anything that Sako action can tolerate.

    David
     
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  12. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    I've never knew that the ppc shooters load such hot loads and it takes custom to hold up. I don't have any plans to shoot competively but would like to get the sako as accurate as possible and i live for working up loads. As far as the chamberimg in this rifle - when i get it how is best way to figure that out - is it as simple as firing a round and measuring case several places ? When i send Harrell's my 3 fired cases will they send any information back with die ? I have to ask again about the used brass - this is not a new barrel so should i buy twice fired Lapua or should i just order a new bag ? And how can i figure out what neck thickness should be ?
     
  13. Ramblerman

    Ramblerman Gold $$ Contributor

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    Not trying to derail, but I own a Sako too, so was wondering what abuse it can't take?

    Will the bolt come back in my face with 6ppc loads that might be on the warm side?

    Just curious, don't want to wreck my pretty mug:confused:
     
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  14. ALBULLET

    ALBULLET Silver $$ Contributor

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    First tell tell sign of a hot load in your Sako will be a hard bolt lift after firing. The primer will also tell you if your load is more than your firing pin can handle. ( cratered primers) ... Don't over size your brass . ( head space) .... The Norma 6PPC brass has a thinner neck than the 220 Russian brass so this may be a good start for the Sako . Plus the 220 Russian will need to have neck expanded and turned:::::Size a piece.... Start over...
    1st: Chamber a piece of 6PPC Norma brass only...Size in full length die until bolt closes with little to no resistance;smooth and easy. Now seat (243)bullet of your choice in the brass. No powder or primer in this dummy round. Chamber this round into you Sako . If bolt closes smooth and easy you should be good to load and fire a round. If bolt is hard to close after seating a bullet into your brass you may have a tighter neck than this chamber will allow : meaning you need to turn the neck thickness down a few .001...At this point be safe and get someone to help you if your not familiar with tight neck chambers or turning case necks. Get back with us when you reach this point. BE SAFE. ONCE IT HAPPENS ; ITS TOO LATE.
    Bodily harm or damage your gun.

    Scotty Grimes Call before you dig 256-283-1425
     
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  15. dgeesaman

    dgeesaman Gold $$ Contributor

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    I'm not an expert but like you I enjoy perpetually working up loads.

    If the gun came with any fired brass, then you can measure that as a reference point. For true data, get a chamber cast and measured.

    My Norma loaded rounds have about a .266 neck right now, IIRC. After firing, they blow out to .270 or .271. It's a bit much of neck sizing but for a factory chamber this is par for the course. I don't think Lee still makes collet dies for the PPC but that's what I used. Fire them a few times and neck size down until you get a firm bolt lift and send them to Harrell's for their best fitting die. They should mention which size of die it is (#0 for mine I think) but it doesn't matter since their dimensions are not published. Set this up with a reasonable bushing and proper headspace and you get excellent one-step sizing.

    If you really want Lapua call a benchrest shop and buy cases that are already blown out to 6PPC dimensions with necks turned to the spec you prefer. That way you don't rip up your only 6PPC rifle / barrel just making brass. SHould run $2/case.

    I know benchrest shooters that will crush 30 grains of LT-32 into their PPC cases. Ignore their loads and stay closer to the reloading guide limits. The Sako action performs well but the lugs aren't beefy as a custom bolt. Keep your bolt lugs lubed too. I've never cratered a primer (that I noticed) but I do get sticky bolt lift on occasion.
     
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  16. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    Dageesaman i appreciate that info. After i get the rifle in hand i may have to ask a few more questions. I think the bushing will be correct one from previous owner but i will have to figure sizing out on my own and that is where i will need some info. May ship tomorrow so maybe i will receive by weekend unless weather up there is issue. Thanks again
     
  17. dgeesaman

    dgeesaman Gold $$ Contributor

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    Here are some more opinions:
    - I have two 6PPC "A1" Sakos. I put brand new Optilock bases and rings on each one and both sets aimed the scope several feet to the left at 100y. Even using mechanical trickery I struggled. I'm happy now with Redfield SDT #47349 bases for Sako tapered dovetails and Burris Signature rings with "Leupold" style mounts. While I suspect the issue with the newer Optilocks, the Leupold windage adjust allowed me to put things right on the optical center.
    - Norma brass in 6PPC works well and is available in 25ct boxes from Midway. I recommend starting with that.
    - H322 powder, and CCI BR4 primers or Federal GM205 primers.
    - Either the T36 or NF 42x will show the capabilities of this rifle.
     
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  18. Schandler

    Schandler Gold $$ Contributor

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    I’m glad you mentioned problem with sako optilock. As of now plan is to put nf br On it so 30mm and high rings ? I will try to find and order redfield base and i like the Burris rings. I never liked the windage adjustable Leupold but i have them on couple of rifles and never had trouble. I have several powders but only 3/4 lb of 322. I use it for a xr100 204 rifle that i actually bought from member on here and it’s an accurate rifle. Need to stock up i gues. I’m only getting Lapua brass with rifle and a few loaded rounds . Don’t mind turning necks but thought the Norma necks were thin or wouldn’t allow enough neck tension ? The hart barrel i am not sure on chamber specs. Will have to have help after i get it to figure out. So do you think it is the optilock rings or holes in receiver not center ? Not really sure on how optilock are designed. Are they similar to ruger mounts ?
     
  19. Dusty Stevens

    Dusty Stevens COVFEFE- Thread Derail Crew Gold $$ Contributor

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    Get dj’s brass service to send you some hydroformed lapua brass. No need in playing around.
     
  20. dgeesaman

    dgeesaman Gold $$ Contributor

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    The Optilocks use a proprietary tapered dovetail. There is a side clamp that gives a little adjustment but something was just too far off. Two rifles, two sets of Optilock mounts. I did not have a quick way to check the alignment but old Optilock bases do not seem to have the problem.

    I’m a fan of the self aligning polymer insert rings, be it Optilock or Burris Signature. The Redfield Leupold style bases are the only combination I found for this Sako rifle with polymer inserts.

    My last batch of Norma brass was around .012” per side. Lapua skims clean at .0135” per side; I don’t know what it measures unturned.

    When I got started I too intended to emulate the benchrest shooters and bought a 100pc bag of pre formed and pre turned Lapua from Larry D Scott. It is very good stuff, for sure. But you shouldn’t order it until you know the final neck thickness. If your chamber turns out to be a tight neck, that’s the perfect solution. The brass is a bit expensive but it lasts a long time and it’s durable.

    If your chamber is deemed “no turn”, then don’t punish yourself by waiting for custom cut Lapua, just buy a 25ct of the Norma and get to it. The difference is small if even measurable.
     

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