LT30 VV N130 65gr 6PPC

Discussion in '6PPC, 6-6.5x47, 6XC, 6 Rem, 243' started by mr.big, Feb 15, 2018.

  1. mr.big

    mr.big

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    anybody shooting these faster powders in the 6PPC with Barts 65 BT or 65 FB,,,,I read somewhere that LT30 was actually closer to T322 than LT32 was ,,I plan on tryin them both but any results yall done have with these powders would be good to hear,,

    thanx
     
  2. 357Mag

    357Mag

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    mr.big -

    Howdy !

    I've heard that one of those two "LT" powders was not going to be manufactured anymore.
    What have you heard about that ?

    I gave a can of LT-32 to a benchrest shooting friend of mine, to try w/ his 65's.
    He recently shot a group submitted for potential new world record ( NBRSA ) and did that shooting VV133.
    I imagine he's in no hurry to try LT-32 in 6PPC.


    With regards,
    357Mag
     
  3. urbanrifleman

    urbanrifleman Gold $$ Contributor

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    Maybe Bart will comment. He has the skinny on these powders. I bought 16 lbs of LT32 on his recommendation.
     
  4. BartsBullets

    BartsBullets Gold $$ Contributor

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    I prefer Lt 30 and Lt 32 in a ppc! I take them both to matches. Either should work great with the 65s

    Bart
     
  5. WyleWD

    WyleWD Gold $$ Contributor

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    NOT true. Another rumor or misunderstanding.
    Verified it with a call to the manufacturer that they have no plans or intentions discontinue either. ;) WD
     
  6. 357Mag

    357Mag

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    WyleWD -

    Howdy !

    Thanx a bunch for the info. Cleared it up, for me !


    With regards,
    357Mag
     
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  7. dedogs

    dedogs Gold $$ Contributor

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    Bart, In a previous post you recommended V-133 for the PPC during cool/cold weather periods and the LT powders for warmer weather. Has your thinking changed on this subject? dedogs
     
  8. BartsBullets

    BartsBullets Gold $$ Contributor

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    No V133 works very well in the winter. It just gets spastic in hot weather. But the LT powders will Work to.
     
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  9. shooter74

    shooter74

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    I found some LT32 local. What weight is everyone starting with using 65-68 fb bullets? Just got a new to me ppc first one I’ve owned. Can’t fine vv133 local, have h322 on hand just looking for a good powder to try out.
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2018
  10. mr.big

    mr.big

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    start around 27.5 and work up slowly..28.6-28.8 is where I am now,,may back down some when it warms up,,
     
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  11. SteveOak

    SteveOak Silver $$ Contributor

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    What would you recommend for a 'summer' alternative to N133. 'Summer' as in Phoenix so both hot and very low humidity at least until the end of June when the humidity gets ridiculously high like 25% or more. :)

    6BR, -0.100" so PPC case capacity, 65 -68gr bullet.
     
  12. urbanrifleman

    urbanrifleman Gold $$ Contributor

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    Maybe with these new powders someone should revisit 6br on the short line.
     
  13. Dusty Stevens

    Dusty Stevens COVFEFE Gold $$ Contributor

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    They do it all the time. Somebody is shooting a br or variant at every big match but they never win on a regular enough basis to turn anybody. Theyve been doing it for over 20yrs that i know of and have never won a major match
     
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  14. SmittyJon

    SmittyJon Silver $$ Contributor

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    I have not had consistent results using 66-68 gr bullets with either LT30 or N130, in a 6ppc. Rather than go into a detailed show 'n tell, after several sessions with each it appears both powders have a very narrow "tune window." Even with a tuner they'd shoot the lights out on one target, and ten minutes later I couldn't hit my a$$ with both hands on the next! :( Additionally they both acted "spikey," which is (state of) Maine-speak for quick to over-pressure. That showed up with hard bolt lift, flat primers, and chronograph readings that were all over Hell-and-back. I gave it up and stayed with my "goto" IMR 8208 load.

    A season or two ago another poster had great luck with "LT31" in a 6PPC. As you might suspect, it was a mix of LT30 and LT32. Not one to poo-poo (as in ridicule, or dismiss - not a #2 :) ), something without trying it, I bought a pound of each and had at it. Initial tests went well. Somewhere around 28.0 grains of a 50:50 mix gave about 3,380 ft/sec and no extraction problems, but the chronograph numbers weren't great. Less than 28 grs had worse numbers, and even a little more gave bolt click. On an IBS 100 yd score target in mild conditions, the load would just drive a couple for X's, and then throw the next one for a "hanger (down south called a "line-licker") 10! Another session with it about a week later gave the same results, so I threw in the towel on the effort.

    Both of these powders appear to have identical sized grains. For the two cans I had the only difference I could see was the LT30 grains were shinier than the LT32 ones. For the mix I had put 2 weighed ounces of each in an empty 1 lb powder bottle, which was then swirled and tumbled around by hand for about 5 minutes. Now, sometime after abandoning the effort I wondered if the blend wasn't mixed well enough. I took a small sample and put it under a magnifier. Lo and behold (!) it was easy to pick out groups, or clumps, of shiny grains and dull ones. A-ha! Inconsistent results are being caused by a poor mix i.e., some rounds had more (or less) of one powder, than the other. Easy fix . . . just mix the mix, longer! So I did that several times, checking the progress with the magnifier after each 4-5 minutes twirl, shake, and tumble session. Contrary to my expectation that the mix would become better blended . . . it didn't! In fact it didn't seem to change at all. The grains of one or the other continued to group together. I gave up at that point. The only explanation I could come up with is maybe the deterrent coating was causing the grouping together effect, but who knows. I don't have a rotary tumbler, so I didn't try mixing it that way. Someone who does and wants to give it try can. If so, please let me know what happened.

    Chris Mitchell
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2018
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  15. SteveOak

    SteveOak Silver $$ Contributor

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    What primers do you use with LT 32 and a 65?
     
  16. BartsBullets

    BartsBullets Gold $$ Contributor

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    Federal 205
     
  17. Pablo

    Pablo Silver $$ Contributor

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    FWIW this year I'm shooting VV133 in the morning when it's cool and LT31 in the afternoon when it's warm. It's interesting that in moderate temps it shoots 28.8 of the 133 and 27.2 of the 31 at the same tuner setting on 4 barrels I have 2 Bartlein and 2 Lederer. First thing in the morning it likes the tuner out about a line, in the afternoon in about a line.YMMV The Lederer barrels have Ezell tuners and the Bartlein's have Buckys tuners. Both setups work the same. Last weekend at a score match it shot great on Saturday with 133 in the morning and 31 in the afternoon, it was a jack around match so I shot the 31 on Sunday morning and had a not quite "line licker" nine at about 7oclock on the target. It was appx 55 degrees. I don't know what temp it was when Smitty had his issues with 31 but it was probably cool. 31 will really shoot in moderate temps.
     
  18. shooter74

    shooter74

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    I’m at 28.7 shooting good .005 off the lands, getting a little primer flow that showed up when it was warmer out. So I’m going to back off to 28-28.2 range and work there it shot well in this range also. I may visit 28.7 again this fall or winter.
     
  19. Pablo

    Pablo Silver $$ Contributor

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    In an attempt to assemble some statistical data that is meaningful, three of us that are friends out here in the west are shooting the same bullets, powder --- LT31 and the same seating depth, tuners also. With 6 rifles and barrels from 3 manufacturers 27.2 and 66 grain boattail bullets they all shoot. Shot the same load last year with no tuner only shot poorly in one barrel which is now on the scrap pile. These same rifles will also shoot 133 fine, either 28.8, 29.9, 29.3 something along those lines. Maybe you should consider a new barrel, the damage a junk barrel can cause to your head is much worse than the cost of a new barrel.
     
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  20. SmittyJon

    SmittyJon Silver $$ Contributor

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    Pablo, at the time I was experimenting with the mix, the barrel (HV Hart w 1:14" twist) was relatively new with 5-600 rounds on it. My goto IMR 8208 at the time was 29.8 gr, with a 64 gr Berger Column, seated about 0.005" into the lands. It shot consistently well from the lo 40's to the mid-80's, dry or humid, so I don't think the barrel was causing the inconsistency I was experiencing.

    The season before the LT31 experiment, I was running low on my last bottle of vintage 2015 BR and was looking for a replacement powder. Along came a great deal on LT32 (Lot #7), so I bought 16 lbs of it. I wrote a long and involved post about my struggles with that powder on either Benchrest Central or here on Accurate Shooter, so I'm not going to rehash it. Cutting to the chase, it took me most of that season to realize that it shot great if it was cool and dry, or warm and dry. If it was cool and damp or warm and humid, it shot like sh**! A regular poster and BR competitor said it was "schizophrenic," and took both it and N133 to Matches. He would switch to 133 if the LT32 load "blew up," i.e., went to Hell. I suggested at the time, that because LT32 grains were so small they must have a lot of deterrent coating to control their burning speed, and maybe that coating absorbed enough moisture to change the way it burned. I had no way to prove that at the time, nor do I do now. After using over 7 lbs of it, I gave up.

    As for the LT31, I still think my mix(ing) was the likely problem, but barrels and components are expensive and time is irreplaceable. If something isn't working well for me (or working at all), why would I keep flailing away at it when I have something else that works great?

    Chris Mitchell
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2018
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