Induction brass annealer redux

Discussion in 'Reloading Forum (All Calibers)' started by Gina1, Aug 26, 2016.

  1. Gina1

    Gina1

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    Not your basic GinaErick. You guys are making my head spin. Guess I'm just an old throw back :eek::eek::eek:
    I have my old slide rule in a glass case "in case of power failure, break glass"
    My hats off to all you young whipper snappers.
     
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  2. SGK

    SGK Silver $$ Contributor

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    True but it was able to provide insight as to how Aztec mode on the AMP may work. See:

    #114
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2019
  3. gravelyctry

    gravelyctry Gold $$ Contributor

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    Thought I’d show mine off - I’m really proud of it and really appreciative of everyone’s help here, especially Gina and Eric.

    I used some of the ideas I liked from others builds, and incorporated them into this one, but it’s a basic GinaErik unit.

    Changes include the TDK Lambda power supply that someone showed earlier in the string (48v1000w). I was able to get it for only $80 because I only offered the seller that much 4 or 5 times. I finally wore them down and they gave it. That was about the end of my frugality.

    I used a larger induction board with two cooling fans to go with it, and upgraded the cooling pump/reservoir as I figured the larger ps and induction board would need more cooling. I wish I could use larger coils to get more flow and take advantage of its capacity.

    I used a chassis mount computer case which came with two fans, two switches, and LEDs. I reused all of those items in the build. I couldn’t figure out how to get the USB ports working as charging ports, so they’re just dead.

    It works well, and I’m extremely happy. Thanks again to everyone for your input to this thread.

    Neil
     

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  4. ottsm

    ottsm

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    I can see I need to upgrade my wooden experimental board and get myself a computer case as well. I may also spring for the 1000W PS now that cheaper sources are showing up, the 600W just barely makes it and I'm often turning the voltage down to avoid over current.
     
  5. 270guy

    270guy

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    Hi All,
    thought I'd post this, just in case there are any other handy people, that are not electrical people building this great thing. Please let me stress this is for anyone who has higher voltage thatn 110v. I'm thinking of other Kiwis and West Islanders (Aussies).
    I made the error of using the wrong contactor - Packard C230B (coil is rated to 120 VAC). This is a problem when you are on 230 - 240 V! I thought when I ordered it, the 230 in the part number was 230 V. No biggie, but this may help someone out.
    The annealer did work for a while, even feeding the contactor 230V!
    So you live and learn.
    cheers
    Brendon
     
  6. SGK

    SGK Silver $$ Contributor

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    Thoroughly defeated West Islanders!
     
  7. 270guy

    270guy

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    1:1 depending on how you at it. Although almost a whole generation of Australian players, who have never won the Bledisloe Cup (17 years). Lucky they get to play for every year, or maybe we'd be saying, "4 more years, Boys!".
    Enough off topic. :)
     
  8. KeeWay

    KeeWay

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    I just finished my version and I want to say thanks Gina/Erick for making this open source.

    After reading this entire thread a few times I decided to design the core control using an Arduino Due and Nextion Enhanced Touchscreen. These Arduino parts I already had were left over from a older project I completed last year so I thought since my idea for this this was similar I would give it a shot. I also used some other ideas from this thread (thanks everyone) and it worked out great. I made the coil using 3/16" copper tubing with the coil opening at 1.375" and the shelf will drop down about 3.5". Even though I currently shoot only .308 I wanted to make it as versatile as I could for the future so currently I can anneal anywhere from .300 BLK to .50 BMG brass :)

    here is a brief parts breakdown of my build...

    Arduino Due.
    Arduino SD card shield.
    Nextion Enhanced 3.5" Touchscreen (NX4832K035).
    Guardian Electric T6X12-I-12VDC Solenoid for drop door.
    ebay Volt/Ammeter.
    828-OPB819Z Optical Case Sensor.
    48V 20A 1000W ebay power supply.
    12V 5A brick power supply.
    1800W ZVS induction board .
    Nema 11 Stepper Motor with 100mm shaft.
    100mm linear rails.
    40A & 100A ebay Fotek SSR's.
    Old 12v water pump I had.
    3/16" copper tubing for coil.

    here is a brief vid of the functionality, currently I still need to work out the actual anneal timings as this was mainly the cycle test.


    thanks
    James
     

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  9. KeeWay

    KeeWay

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    here are more pics of the functional screens.

    thanks
    James
     

    Attached Files:

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  10. David101

    David101

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    N
    Not at the Target rifle world champonships. Perhaps you are referring to some other game with a ball. :)

    @KeeWay that's a very nice looking build. One of mine with the SSR is playing up I am pretty convinced it is the SSR not sure just how to protect that device.
     
  11. Gina1

    Gina1

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    James.....
    What can I say but "WOW" !!! What a build. Not just the electronics, but the programming. This would give the AMP unit a run for the money. The one thing the AMP has going for it is the library of pre-programmed annealing times/cases, but it needs to have a pilot for different sized cases. And then of course the case needs to be inserted/extracted from the pilot. AND the start button, needs to be pressed.(all time consuming). With your design, you could have a anneal times for every case, pre-programmed, as well as trap door height. With auto cycle you have a winner.
    Very nice build.
    Gina
     
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  12. KeeWay

    KeeWay

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    Thanks. i did have issues with the cheap ebay Fotek SSR's either not allowing all the voltage to pass or just burning out. i did find some youtube vids showing the insides of these SSR's and they said the components were not actually rated for the advertised current so i just went as large as i could find. i went with the 100A SSR for the induction coil even though i am running a max 20A through it and 40A for the drop solenoid using 1A max. these seemed to hold up so far :D.
     
  13. KeeWay

    KeeWay

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    Gina thanks for the kind words, I would not have completed this with out your post and everyone else's as well. Just wanted to say I am in no way a real programmer or electrical tech and do this for fun/learning so once i get the final tweaks i will be more than happy to post all my source files to keep this going as an open source project. Maybe some real programmer can tweak my code enough to not rely on the Arduino Due speed/memory and maybe scale it down to a nano :D.

    thanks
    James
     
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  14. jthor

    jthor

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    Very interesting to see the evolution of all the mods/upgrades some of us have done just continue to evolve with new GinaErick annealers!
     
  15. SGK

    SGK Silver $$ Contributor

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    Just need to crack Aztec

    The work by @LR88 has promise
     

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  16. kit-808

    kit-808

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    20190825_154620.jpg
    Had to change direction of my build, got the Nano all programed, just got the wiring to do now
     
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  17. David101

    David101

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    @SGK I agree with you about furthering the work and data collecting in relation To case in the coil (we need to come up with some way of standardizing this my coil is a turn shorter and a bigger tube to allow for more coolant flow very little change i think it) Time VS Current. Time Vs Temperature and Maximum temperatures.

    I found with the coil well inserted I could use a time of up to 6.2 seconds and draw 16A at 45 mm from the top of the case level with the top of the coil. This Annealed further down the case but only a little bit more than factory. The case certainly changed colour after heating but it did not take on a red glow.

    So there are certainly a mix and match of variables to give similar results.

    I am pretty certain that AMP use a current draw method to profile the brass. I am not sure this is anyway helpful for the home builder. I feel much more comfortable coming from the other end slowly increasing times and playing with seating depths. I think investing in some higher temperature Templiaq would also be helpfull. At one stage people were buying 450 to make sure it didnt get too hot at the base of the case. This has been proven not to be a worry so we need to work towards the other end.

    I dont think we should be aiming to make a AMP machine this is our own collective design with many significant benifits lets keep working towards that goal.
     
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  18. KeeWay

    KeeWay

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    So far testing the annealer has worked out great just working through one issue that i am not sure on and maybe someone can provide any insite. No matter where in the coil I put the case with tempilaq 750 the same results happen just times are either longer or slower. So when i start the heating cycle and you can see the tempilaq disappearing from the top of the case mouth downward to the shoulder which i believe is normal. My concern is that if i run it so that you see annealing marks maybe 1/4" below the shoulder (most pics i see on the net) the case mouth heats up and glows red which i believe is over the 750 degrees and maybe over annealing it. what i have done to not heat up the case is if i turn off the lights and run the cycle till it just barely turns red then reduce the time by 1/2-1 sec the annealing seems to only reach the shoulder or 1/16-1/8" below the shoulder. Is this ok or something else i should be looking at? i have tried this mainly on Military LC, Herters and Prvi brass.

    also here is my Arduino code as well as the Nextion LCD firmware/Design file.

    thanks
    James
     

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  19. SGK

    SGK Silver $$ Contributor

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    No one knows but I now place the thickest part of the case I want to touch 750F (ie the lowermost point, about one shoulder width down the case wall) in the middle of the coil. With 308 brass this means the case mouth is right at the top of the coil. No glow.
     
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  20. David101

    David101

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    I found the same as SGK I was placing the 308 case mouth slightly below the top of the coil and while the case would all reach the 750 without the case mouth glowing red the time was say 4.8 seconds and the case only had a slight change in look.
    As I moved the case mouth up in the coil the the case mouth took a lot longer to get any colour change in it. The tempilaq changed colour downwards on the case I could take the time well out to close to 6 seconds this was giving the case mouth some glow occasionally. The case overall changed colour dramatically but still the tempilaq did not change further down the case.
    My decision was to go with the case higher up in the coil the top of the case just below the top of the coil I then increased the time a small amount to about 5.2 seconds this show a slight colour change on the case to just below the shoulder all the way around. Next time I buy tempilaq I will buy some in the hotter ranges. I will see where my machine is getting to and perhaps a comercial machine as well as I think these get hotter as well. Although perhaps it could all be about placement in the field and the field shape.
     

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