ARIZONA BILL WOULD MAKE GOVT LIABLE FOR GUN FREE ZONE

Discussion in 'Main Message Board' started by ngb1787, Feb 16, 2020.

  1. ngb1787

    ngb1787 Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2016
    Messages:
    457
    PHOENIX — State lawmakers voted this past week to create a financial disincentive for state and local governments — and even schools — to try to keep weapons off their property.

    SB 1664, approved by the Senate Judiciary Committee on a 4-3 party-line vote, says that anyone who is injured while in a government-created “gun-free zone’’ can sue that agency for any damages. All the victim would have to show is that a reasonable person would believe that the injury would not have occurred if the victim had been allowed to keep a weapon to defend himself or herself.

    Sen. David Gowan, R-Sierra Vista, who is sponsoring SB 1664, said the law is justified.

    “If a government entity creates gun-free zones which prohibit a law-abiding citizen from defending themselves, that if harm comes to them because of that policy, that government entity will be held liable for the damages,’’ he said. “So the point is, if you’re going to have a policy like this you protect the citizen or allow them to protect themselves, or there will be consequences.’’

    Stephanie Richardson, a volunteer with Moms Demanding Action, a group that seeks new gun regulations, told lawmakers that approving this measure sends the wrong message.

    “This bill would have a chilling effect on government entities choosing to exercise their authority to take the steps they feel are necessary to keep their citizens safe,’’ she said. And Howard Neiberg, another member of the same organization, said this measure would work against public safety.

    “Allowing guns in places has already been proven to be a heightened risk of safety, putting Arizona families and communities at risk,’’ he said.

    Gowan said the goal of his bill actually is just the reverse.

    The problem with the current law, Gowan said, is that it allows government agencies to put up signs declaring the buildings and the surrounding areas to be gun-free zones.

    “Criminals don’t care about law,’’ he said.

    “They don’t say, ‘Oh, there’s a sticker on the wall here that says no guns so I’d better not bring a gun in,’” Gowan continued. “What you’re saying is the law-abiding citizen who sees that, they’re not going to take it in.’’

    The result, he said, is that the unarmed person is left defenseless because of the policy.

    And Gowan said he’s not concerned that his legislation will result in — and potentially encourage — people who go into schools to bring their weapons with them and not leave them in their vehicles.

    “What I’m concerned with is that anybody that’s a law-abiding citizen is protected, at all times,’’ he said. “That’s the issue.’’

    Merissa Hamilton told lawmakers that, as a survivor of domestic violence, she has to carry a gun to protect herself. Only thing is, she said, is she was working for a member of the Phoenix City Council. And that building has a no-guns policy.

    She described an incident with a homeless person who was “acting erratic and having a mental health crisis and attacked me several times.

    “There was no one there to protect me and I had to wait for police to arrive, cowering once again in fear and having to relive the violence that happened to me prior,’’ Hamilton said.

    “Being able to carry a gun saves my life,’’ she said. “And if government is going to prohibit that then they should have to be responsible for keeping me safe.’’

    Roxanne Pitones, lobbyist for the League of Arizona Cities and Towns, told lawmakers one problem with the measure is that it makes local governments “strictly liable’’ for any injury that occurs to anyone in a public building. She said that goes far beyond existing laws that allow people who believe they were injured to sue, but with a requirement to prove in court that the injury was caused at least in part by the government agency’s negligence.

    That did not bother Sen. Eddie Farnsworth, R-Gilbert. He said that cities are still entitled to due process, even with strict liability.

    It now goes to the full Senate.
     
  2. T-shooter

    T-shooter

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Messages:
    1,741
    If you can legally carry a firearm, are denied the right, and get injured because of it, you should be able to sue.
     
  3. D-4297

    D-4297 Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2019
    Messages:
    363
    Nick ; We can only hope some of our spineless law-makers will stand up and pass this through both chambers and , if nothing else , make the "Government can fix everything Anti-gun Lefties" understand that "THEY" will now pay for their foolishness .

    Meanwhile ; another Bill was introduced to the Az. Legislature on Friday . S.B. 1625 . Another ban of all "Assualt Rifles" ( AR's , SKS , AK's and any semi-auto , magazine fed rifle , along with High Cap Magazines , etc. , similar to some of the Virginia & Ky. Bills . Haven't seen the full Bill yet .
     
  4. ShootDots

    ShootDots Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2008
    Messages:
    5,315
    Even the fact that the bill has made it to the full senate, tells me that this state is still a "Pro-2nd Amendment" state! I believe that the Second Amendment will be a defining issue in many campaigns! President Trump has brought it to the forefront and several liberal legislatures have went against the second amendment and fanned the flames of even people who do not own a gun, however, believe in the Constitution!
     
    Idaho-Lefty, mikeinct, D-4297 and 6 others like this.
  5. ebb

    ebb

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2010
    Messages:
    2,335
    Now if they write in a clause that says who ever requested and pushed the bill through is personally liable, we will see some serious back peddling.
     
    mikeinct, NZ_Fclass, FeMan and 4 others like this.
  6. 6fatrat

    6fatrat SLING SHOOTER Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2011
    Messages:
    350
    Arizona is on the right track.
    President Trump is teaching the Republicans to stand up and fight back!
    Steve Bair
     
  7. Texas10

    Texas10 Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,838
    If the goal is to arm everybody, perhaps widespread use of tasers would be a better answer. They will stop an attack just as effectively but with less lethality.
     
  8. Twicepop

    Twicepop Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2018
    Messages:
    371
    It's long past due for them to grow a back bone, I've likened the Republicans to a scene from "Animal House". The Democrats are the guy with the hooded robe swinging the large paddle, the Republicans are Kevin Bacon bent over getting whacked with the paddle saying "thank you sir, may I have another".
     
    mikeinct, Whitey, KMart and 2 others like this.
  9. m1jeff

    m1jeff

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2014
    Messages:
    116
    I have personally seen tasers fail to incapacitate on several occasions.

    When it does work, what’s your plan when the five second ride is over?
     
  10. C.E.Smith043

    C.E.Smith043 Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2017
    Messages:
    332
    I don't agree with this for several reasons. 1. Criminals will still be armed with firearms. Don't bring a taser to a gun fight. 2. Distance is critical with a taser. 3. If u miss it's to slow to reload.
     
    Idaho-Lefty, mikeinct, Whitey and 3 others like this.
  11. Texas10

    Texas10 Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,838
    Good points! Tasers aren't a perfect answer, but neither is a handgun. I've seen film of two guys with 44 cal single actions stand face to face, empty 5 shots into each other before laying down to die. I think it was a KKK rally about 30 years ago.

    In the recent Texas church shooting six seconds elapsed from the time the shooter pulled his shotgun, shot and killed two guards before being shot dead by a third guard. Then for the next minute and a half we watch all these guys with CC's running around pointing their guns at everybody. Can you imagine what would've happened if one of them accidentally discharged his weapon? Holy shi* wouldn't begin to describe the carnage.
     
  12. Joe Salt

    Joe Salt Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    May 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,022
    Texas 10, Well it didn't happen, you sound like a Democrat, we all aren't running around with our fingers on the trigger. I'd still like to say I tried to protect myself or others than stand there and get shot. THINK ABOUT IT!

    Joe Salt
     
  13. USMCDOC

    USMCDOC

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2016
    Messages:
    2,952
  14. 6ShotsOr5?

    6ShotsOr5? Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2017
    Messages:
    524
    You carry a taser if you prefer, but I’ll keep my snubby.
     
  15. Texas10

    Texas10 Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,838
    You wish! Nope, not a Democrat or a Republican. I'm one of those pesky INDEPENDANTS who prefer to think for themselves, and not be goat roped by a scoundrel or narcissist promoting emotional porn such as FOX news "they're going to take your guns away" BS.

    I've survived two murder attempts in my life, once when I was 11 by a mean old man and his wife who tried to kidnap me, and again when 18 by a coworker and Vietnam vet suffering PTSD. I was armed that time and it saved my life.

    This doesn't include the drunk driver who came the closest to killing me when I was 3.

    So I am a pragmatist. I don't believe we'd be better off with everybody carrying, nor do I feel we'd be safer outlawing widespread gun ownership like UK and NZ. I'm also happy Texas finally outlawed drinking while driving, but would never support a return to prohibition just because some drunk almost killed me, and years later did kill my Dad.
     
    spclark and DickE like this.
  16. 500yards

    500yards

    Joined:
    May 9, 2019
    Messages:
    124
    No amount of money can bet a dead man his life back, this laws aren't structure to save properties and protect lives. Nothing can compare to the freedom of baring arms.
     
    Idaho-Lefty and mikeinct like this.
  17. D-4297

    D-4297 Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2019
    Messages:
    363
    Having seen the end results of countries that were dis-armed by benevolent governments , no one can , or ever will convince me that I should ever give up my gun without a fight . China , Laos , Cambodia , Vietnam , Germany , Yugoslavia , Rumania , Czechoslovakia , and the list goes on . In our own hemisphere ; Nicaragua , El Salvador , Guatemala , Venezuela . Nope ! It don't take a round from a AK to convince me . Come and take it ! And you can have it when it goes "CLICK" ! I've seen Liberal-Socialist gun control up close and personal , and the results are sickening . As some great man once said : A man with a gun is a Citizen ....A man without a gun is a subject .....Thankfully ; Our fore-fathers gave each and everyone of us that choice . Choose wisely , for you will only get to do it once .
     
  18. Joe Salt

    Joe Salt Silver $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    May 10, 2014
    Messages:
    2,022
    Texas10 Thanks for the rep lie! Figured Texas was a pretty safe place to live,Guess not. So I think I'll stay up here in snow country, keeps the crazies away. But our Governor is the only crazy person I have to worry about. With a little luck Donnie JR. will run for Governor in two years. I know he's pro-Gun.

    Joe Salt
     
    Idaho-Lefty, Whitey and Preacher like this.
  19. Thauglor

    Thauglor Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2013
    Messages:
    167
    So you are living on 2001? Because that is when it became illegal to drink and drive in Texas, but it was illegal far before 2001 to be driving drunk. Now go get informed about total gun bans, you can use this great feature that has evolved considerably since 2001, called the internet.

    So far, you aren't proving to anyone you can think independently.
     
    mikeinct and poorboy like this.
  20. Texas10

    Texas10 Gold $$ Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2016
    Messages:
    1,838
    Amazing to me how some folks can't make point without hurling insults. We don't all have the same mindset. That's what makes America great, and different from so many autocracies and monotheistic societies. Russia, North Korea, Iran, Syria all come to mind if you'd prefer to move to a country that stifles thought and polite discourse. You do seem comfortable with that, or am I mistaken?
     

Share This Page