.30 Cal. Bullets not going into Fired Casing

Discussion in 'Reloading Forum (All Calibers)' started by centershot, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. rhovee

    rhovee

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    I just went and measured some virgin annealed brass that was loaded and it measured .295. Fired brass was .294. That could explain my frustration with trying to develop loads with virgin brass. Or finding a load, and then using some virgin brass and have it not shoot good. Should i neck turn .001 off virgin brass?
     
  2. Ringostar

    Ringostar

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    Are you talking .0005 off the neck for a .001 extra clearance, or .001 off neck for .002 total? Are you going to purchase neck turning equipment, or hire it out?
     
  3. rhovee

    rhovee

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    Just a half. I have had great accuracy with fired brass before. But new annealed brass and carbon build up sound like my problem. Might take a few passes in my hands with some 0000 steel wool and see if that takes some of the annealing off?
     
  4. spclark

    spclark Gold $$ Contributor

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    Annealing’s thru’n’thru, not a surface effect. You can take the patina off but the metal underneath won’t be affected by anything besides further ‘working’.
     
  5. Tucker65

    Tucker65 Silver $$ Contributor

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    Is it any 30 caliber bullet or just the ones you happen to be using? I had an issue with some Berger bullets that were bigger on the boat tail end by a very small amount. They wouldn't go into a fired case either. If you turned them around and put them in pointy end first they would slide right in right up to about were the boat tail starts. All other 30 caliber bullets I had on hand slide in nicely.

    John
     
  6. fguffey

    fguffey

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    Fantastic: And now we are being told when the neck does not expand to seal the chamber gas does not escape past the neck and the gas does not get trapped between the case body and chamber. I believe some responders just make this stuff up. When my necks do not expand and or I use a powder that is too slow I get carbon on the neck, shoulder and case body.

    F. Guffey
     
  7. fguffey

    fguffey

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    I take a rifle to the range, I fire a round and then place the bullet of the next round to be fired in the neck of the fired case, I have never had a bullet lock up in the neck of the fired case.

    F. Guffey
     
  8. Tucker65

    Tucker65 Silver $$ Contributor

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    Not quite sure I follow this. How can the bullet of the next round to be fired be inserted into the just fired case if it's already seated into the next round to be fired.
     
  9. fguffey

    fguffey

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    The bullet in the next case to be fired is held by the neck of the case, the fired case neck expanded to release the bullet when fired; when the bullet in the unfired case is placed into the neck of the fired case the bullet will slode into the neck until the neck of the unfired case contacts the neck of the fired case.

    If the unfired bullet will not slide into the neck of the fired case the chamber/neck is too tight to release the bullet when fired.

    F. Guffey
     
  10. Tucker65

    Tucker65 Silver $$ Contributor

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    Well that's not where my bullets were getting stuck. If you read my post they were tight right before the boat tail which would be seated into the neck. Unless of coarse you're reloading your bullets with the fat end sticking out.

    John
     
  11. stifffingers

    stifffingers Silver $$ Contributor

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    According To Alex Finley of annealing made perfect co. annealed brass does not spring back. It's true, to get the desired neck sizing you have to use a bushing .oo1 larger because of no spring back. It worked for me.
     
  12. Ringostar

    Ringostar

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    As Steve said, the steel wool might remove some of the heat coloring but not the amount of metal that you need. I believe that you need to turn some off your neck. You said that a fired case is .001 smaller than your chamber, but a bullet still will not slip into the fired case. This tells me that a loaded round is too tight.
     
  13. rhovee

    rhovee

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    Most of my rounds are .2945 sometimes I get a .294 if I snug up the calipers. Neck is .297. I cleaned it good last night with bore tech eliminator byline brush and patches. I’ll see how she does. After I size with a Redding busing, there are very small vertical lines on the brass. Not sure what that’s about.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  14. mr45man

    mr45man Gold $$ Contributor

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    I try to keep neck clearances to min.
    .0015 on some depending on cal.
    So with brass spring back its normal for
    a bullet not to fall In to the fired neck.
    Normal for me anyhow.
     
  15. fguffey

    fguffey

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    If I was curious about neck clearance before firing I would measure the outside diameter of the case neck, after measuring the outside diameter of the case neck I would sized the case and expand the neck with the expander ball. After expanding the neck after sizing I would seat a bullet and then measure the outside diameter of the case neck. The difference in diameter between the outside of the neck before sizing and after seating a bullet is case neck
    clearance.

    And now a reloader has big butted bullets that will not seat in a fired case: when I place a bullet into the neck of a fired case the bullet hits the inside bottom of the case when I let it go. If the bullet is big butted because it is tapered someone is going to start making tapered seaters for tapered big butted bullets or there will be a gap between the mouth of the case and bullet.

    F. Guffey
     
  16. spclark

    spclark Gold $$ Contributor

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    But anything but to the uninitiated! That it works for you has nothing to do with folks who aren’t as careful watching the other details.

    Minimal neck clearance isn’t the same as minimal freebore diameter either, they’re both important but in different ways.
     
  17. ireload2

    ireload2

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    Unlike guffey I have thousands of cases from .222 on up that will not accept a bullet after being fired. It is only spring back of the neck. It is usually worse at the case mouth.
    A light anneal will get rid of it.
    Fresh new factory brass does not do this unless it has gone through several forming processes. I have 100+ Hornady Frontier cases formed in 3 different dies that are under size after being fired in a M95 Dutch Mannlicher in 6.5X53R Mannlicher caliber. When the last of these cases are fire formed they will need to be annealed.
    Yeah they are too tight for a bullet after being fired in a huge .300 chamber neck. The .300 neck is .012 larger than loaded ammo so the case neck has plenty of room to expand.
     
  18. fguffey

    fguffey

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    It is not possible for a reloader to wake up one morning to find his big butted bullets will not slide through the neck of a fired case from his rifle unless he has never fired the rifle. To determine free bore the reloader has only to have enough ambition to drill the flash hole/primer pocket on a fired case. After drilling the flash hole/primer pocket the reloader must neck size the case to hold the bullet. For me that is not a problem . I want all the bullet hold I can get.

    I could full length size the case but there is case clearance, again, that is not a problem for me because my cases do not have head space.

    F. Guffey
     
  19. Hengehold

    Hengehold Silver $$ Contributor

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    I had the same problem in one of my guns. There was not enough neck clearance between case neck and the chamber. Therefore, there was no space for the case neck to expand to.

    Solution= had to turn about .002 off the necks to create a gap between the loaded cartridge and the chamber. I would try turning 2-3 cases and fire them to see if this solves the problem.

    Good luck,
    -T
     
  20. Alex Wheeler

    Alex Wheeler Gold $$ Contributor

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    Even slipping a bullet into the neck does not indicate you have enough clearance. You need to know what your neck is in the rifle. I want bullets to fall through the neck. That assumes the necks end up about .001" smaller than the neck in the rifle after fired. I have had issues with rifles that you could slide a bullet through a fired neck that were cured by giving a little more clearance still.
     

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