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Author Topic: 6.5 BRM brass (30-30 Win case) won't fit Sinclair priming tool!  (Read 1875 times)

Offline bouddha

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I realize the .30-30 is the redheaded stepchild of wildcat cases, but figured I'd at least be able to use a nice priming tool on them.  I reloaded my original 20 rounds of EABCO brass and took the groups from .80 MOA to just under .50 without even trimming to an equal length.  The original Winchester cases would only fit the Sinclair shellholder 8 out of 10 times, so I got me a nice bage of virgin Hornady brass!  Trimmed'em all to the same length, used my brand new PMA neck turning tool to even up the necks ( a GREAT tool, btw!),  ran them through the 7-08 die then the 6.5.  Thinking I was going to shoot today, I started to load up about half of them to fireform when waiting on my .204 Encore to cool down.  Got the primers out and found that not even one of the Hornadys would fit into the Sinclair (also tried the PMA priming tool to no avail).

Ordered a new shellholder from Sinclair, and asked them to walk down the hall with a fistfull of them and try them out for fitment on the Hornady brass.  Fingers crossed...


Offline spclark

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Bummer.... So it's Hornady's brass that's not made to the same specs to fit the Wilson-style shellholder you've used before on other brand(s) of 30-30 brass?

I had problems with different batches of Jamison Int'l's 25REM when I used it for making up 6HAGAR cases. Found another shellholder # that worked, allowed a bit more metal where the extractor groove was shallower than the first batch.

You faced with something like this or is it a larger diameter case head or thicker rim? Hornady might like to know about it, maybe send you another batch for your trouble....
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”

Offline bouddha

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I believe the rim is both thicker and of a larger diameter, so not sure which is the worst culprit.  I'll give Hornady a shout-out in the morning.  Thanks.


Offline bouddha

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Time for a "no progress" report. :-\

Ordered and received another shellholder from Sinclair...no fit my brass.  Called Sinclair, 'splained my situation to a tech, asked him to try one of their shellholders on Hornady brass, and if it fits send it to me.  He said okay, made all the right notations on the order, and sent me a THIRD shellholder that won't fit my brass.  Plastic envelope containing shellholder was wrinkled, like it was tried for fitment without removing the SH.  So much for any real concern there.

Sent Hornady a detailed account of the problem, but they are apparently less concerned than Sinclair.  I've got one of those 21st Century primer tools, but they don't make a SH for .30-30 brass.

Not a happy chooter today!

Offline spclark

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Sinclair's priming tool used to use Lee shellholders (at least before they came out with their own line of SS items) and Lee's website says their #4 is for 30-30 & some others. Sinclair's list omits the 30-30 entirely.

Have you tried a Lee shellholder or are you using Sinclair-branded that won't fit?

Your first post mentioned WIN brass that also had problems where EABCO'S didn't so my next search would be for another brand of shellholder that'll work.

30-30's rim is 0.5060" dia., 0.0630" (1/16") thick.

45 Colt's just a tad larger @ 0.5120" dia. (+ 0.060") but a 0.003" thinner rim.

307 Winchester's the same as their 30-30 so must have been based on the older case??

Sinclair DOES list a shellholder for 45 (Long) Colt which I believe has the same rim dimensions.

Not knowing where your brass is too big (can you mic a few of the brands you use  then post the largest numbers?) I can't say if this'd be a solution but this all tells you where my thoughts are heading....
« Last Edit: 04:31 PM, 09/14/12 by spclark »
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”

Offline bouddha

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The Win brass was what the EABCO rounds are made with, the Hornady was tried thinking the Winchester brass was at fault.  I now believe it must be the Sinclair SH (packaged as "Lee", btw) that is the offending party.  I'm willing to bet that not many .30-30 reloaders are using the Sinclair tools, thus not much whining about the problem, except by ME!

I don't have a micrometer, and my caliper is not exactly NASA standard, so I can't say with any certainty the rim  thickness nor diameter.  My one attempt showed .502-.500-.504 diameter, and that's on the same case!


Offline spclark

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OK so you have a Lee shellholder you bought from Sinclair, not one of their line of stainless shellholders?

What's the number stamped on it? If it's a #4 that's what Lee says is correct for 30-30.

Your numbers are somewhat less than numbers I got out of my old Speer #13 manual. Then again, depending on the age of those cases Winchester's quality assurance has been in decline the past couple of years.

Are the rims too large in diameter or are they too thick & not able to slide into the grooved shellholder? Either way you're out of luck!

I've tried to modify shellholders myself once or twice (they're really hard) so it might be tricky getting one modified to work with your cases if you even have access to the tools needed.

Since you indicate the shellholders you've gotten from Sinclair are in Lee's packaging I'd get in contact with them Monday & see what they say. It's entirely possible they provide a service where you send them cases & they'll modify a shellholder to work with them.
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”

Offline medic727

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Make life easy and use an RCBS press- or hand-operated priming tool with the universal shellholder (same principle as the shellholder on the Coax press). Their APS strip loaded primers are really the way to control primers. I load for 1000 yd. F-Open and primer seating with the RCBS tool works just fine.

Offline bouddha

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Package says "Sinclair Stainless Steel Lee Shellholder", and it's a #3...ALL of them are #3, and according to information on Sinclair's website, #3 is the correct one for both Lee & Sinclair.

Thanks, Medic...that's almost exactly what  I did.  And in the process reminded myself why I forked over a hunnid and a quarter for the Sinclair.  Primers are in, rightside up and shootable, but no match for the feel and accuracy of depth to the Sinclair or the 21st Century tool.  If easy was all I was after, I'd be shootin' a Salvage using factory ammo poor dead Uncle Leonard left me. ;)

Offline spclark

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Package says "Sinclair Stainless Steel Lee Shellholder", and it's a #3...ALL of them are #3, and according to information on Sinclair's website, #3 is the correct one for both Lee & Sinclair.

Yep, that's what I read there too, part #105003. I think they add the Lee 'cause it's in the Lee-style & Lee just may have a patent on that design.

Here's the web page that shows the Lee #4 for 30-30:

http://leeprecision.com/shell-holder-4.html

- while I found several others where the #3 is correct... which is troubling.

I'd try to obtain a genuine Lee-made #4 though, that cartridge's been around for decades just like Lee. Your situation just might be a result of Sinclair's being a (relatively) new player with their product. Maybe this part's labeling is just plain wrong....

« Last Edit: 12:45 PM, 09/15/12 by spclark »
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”

Offline JRS

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Hornady happens to list their shell holder for their brass as a #2.

Offline spclark

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Hornady happens to list their shell holder for their brass as a #2.

Correct but as each manufacturer uses a different scheme to number their products, that doesn't help when the only part that will fit the tool is a Lee-style.

I've used Sinclair's priming tool for several years (since the RCBS I started with started mis-aligning primers) & ever since used only Lee's shell holders. Sinclair came up with their stainless steel product fairly recently but I doubt they re-engineered their priming tool to use their shell holders exclusively. I trust Lee will work until someone tells me different.

Only way we'll know for sure is for Bouddha to find one, try it with his brass & let us all know what happens.
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”

Offline bouddha

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I'm game...thanks!

Offline bouddha

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Mystery solved!!!

I finally got a couple of Lee shellholders and they fit the Hornady brass perfectly...aparently the Sinclair shellholders were at fault.

Offline spclark

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Glad for ya! Thanks for the good news follow-up.
"The present Democratic Administration has far exceeded our worst apprehensions .  .  . in its general and unvarying abuse of the power intrusted to it by a confiding people.”


 

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